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Transcript: Mayor de Blasio Appears Live on Inside City Hall

June 26, 2017

Errol Louis: We are back on the Road to City Hall. Turning now to our top story – Mayor de Blasio is set to lose control of City schools at this week unless State lawmakers can reach a deal. Here now to talk more about where those negotiations stand is Mayor de Blasio in for this week's Mondays with the Mayor interview.

Welcome, always good to see you.

Mayor Bill de Blasio: Thank you.

Louis: What is the latest on mayoral control of the schools?

Mayor: Well, you're right. We're four days out now. And it's time for everyone in Albany to come back and get to work and finish this. I had a conversation with Governor Cuomo a few hours ago. He remains optimistic that this can be resolved in time. And I appreciate that. But you know, we need to see action from all the leaders. We need them to get back to Albany, get this done. The solution is staring them in the face. We just need to get it done.

Louis: When Governor Cuomo says publicly that it's a legitimate debate, what's your understanding of where and how he wants to guide this?

Mayor: I don't want to speak for him. I think the fact is the discussion should be about governance – what's going to help our schools be the best they can be? And I think the jury has come back a long time ago. Mayoral control of education is the only way to create real accountability. And we see the results – higher graduation rate, higher test scores, lower crime in schools. We have plenty of evidence. You know here's the important point, Errol – I've talked to all of the leaders in Albany, and a lot of the members of the Senate and the Assembly – I don't get anyone saying I've got a better idea than mayoral control, I've got a system that would work better. No one says that. What I think is now starting to dawn on people though is if you lose mayoral control for the biggest school system in the country – plunging it into chaos, literally starting as early as Saturday when we'd have to reconstitute the old central Board of Education – you then start the countdown clock for 32 local school board elections. Now, you and I remember school board elections – famously very low turnout, a whole lot of cronyism, sadly a lot of corruption on those boards. But here's the wrinkle – school board election in Los Angeles for two seats on the central board – $14 million was spent on an election for two seats on the central Board of Education of Los Angeles

Louis: Wow.

Mayor: Hedge funds getting in that, big teacher union contributions. Whatever you think, I think one thing we can all agree on – we don't want big money in politics, and that's precisely what's about to happen if we go back to 32 local school board elections.

Louis: So based on your discussions so far, including with the Governor, how confident are you that this will get resolved?

Mayor: I'm confident the answer is right there, meaning that there is a fair way to do this and to move forward. I am not yet going to say I'm confident that everyone in Albany is ready to act. I want to see them come back to the capitol. That would be something that would give me a little more sense of momentum and confidence to see everyone return to Albany. So that's my central focus right now.

Louis: One of the things that happened with your predecessor is when at one point he had to reconstitute the board because his control ran out, the borough presidents essentially gave him their proxies and let him sort of name what would have been the borough presidents' picks for the Board of Education as it came back to life after which they finally resolved it. Have you had those kinds of discussions with the borough presidents?

Mayor: I've spoken with several of the borough presidents. I'll be speaking to all of them in the next 24 hours or so. Look, I think there's an understanding – certainly amongst those I've spoken to already – this is very serious business – 1.1 million kids, a huge operation, $25 billion budget. The last thing we need is to have the progress we've made undermined. And you know, we're ending a school year, and then before you know it, we're starting a new one about 10 weeks later. And so, I think there's an understanding this is real serious stuff. And keeping continuity with the Chancellor and the policies in place is important. So I won't speak for any of the borough presidents. But I want to say with real appreciation to all of them, that I they understand this is not business as usual, and they're ready to be part of the solution.

Louis: And finally on this topic, is it your belief that this is essentially a partisan divide – the way this is all broken down in Albany?

Mayor: I don't know if it's quite as simple as that. It's an element of the equation unquestionably. But on the other hand, the same State Senate Republicans – a lot of the same individuals happily voted for a seven-year term for mayoral control for Michael Bloomberg and then six more years when they re-upped it. There is a partisan element to this discussion, but I think what's worse in some ways is that it has become part of the back-and-forth and the horse-trading when it really should stand alone. And I think what's been interesting is to see a lot of not only the editorial boards but a lot of the business leadership, including people who are overtly pro-charter school and want to see the continued growth of charters. Most notably, folks from the New York City Partnership have said they want to see that, but that has nothing to do with mayoral control of education. And they want a clean renewal of mayoral control of education because it's prerequisite to everything else working. So I think there's a lot of factors at play. I think this is one where everyone in Albany should say: hey, you know what, let's treat this above the fray because it just – it's not like other issues, it has massive ramifications.

Louis: Let me switch topics. Lynne Patton was officially appointed today as the HUD Administrator, the job you used to have. Now, she said to the New York Times – she mentioned you – and she said he, meaning the Mayor, of all people should know that this is not a housing-heavy role. It's more about what contacts and what connections and what ability do you have to work across bipartisan silos to bring the vision of Region II to fruition. What do you make of that?

Mayor: Look, I don't know her, and I do intend to try and work with her. I think it is a very substantive role. And certainly in my experience with it – you know, I came into the role having been in government before and having some knowledge of housing issues. I had to learn a lot more on the job unquestionably. She's not wrong that an important part of the job is working with leaders on both sides of the aisle locally to try and get things done. That's accurate. But I would urge her to recognize the substantive demands are pretty intense. But my message to her is we want to work with you. In fact, I'd like to show her how much we depend on HUD. There's about 600,000 New Yorkers whose lives are very much determined by HUD policies and HUD programs. And I'd like her to see that and understand the magnitude of it. And my hope is that she will then realize how helpful she could be in that role.

Louis: Have you met her? Have you talked to her?

Mayor: No, I have not. I look forward to it.

Louis: What do you make of her – I mean we've sort of chronicled how when the Chair of the New York City Housing Authority asked for her and for her boss, actually, frankly, Ben Carson, the Secretary of HUD, to tour public housing to sort of get a feel for it, maybe meet some tenants and so forth, they didn't respond. And I don't know if that's a calculated snub or they thought it was irrelevant. What's your sense of what needs to happen?

Mayor: I don't think we know yet, and that's part of the challenge. I spoke to Dr. Carson after he was first confirmed as Secretary. I welcomed him to come see our Housing Authority developments and the other affordable housing programs we have. I still hope that will come to pass. You know, look, when you're dealing with the day-to-day issues that affect so many New Yorkers – we really have no choice but to hope we can find some productive common ground with the appointees. That's a very different matter than what we do in Congress. In Congress, we're going to go and fight for the policies we need, the legislation we need, the budgets we need, working with mayors all around the country, obviously working with our Congressional delegation. But the appointees are the appointees. There's no getting around that. We've got to try and find common ground and get things done with them if we can.

Louis: Before we go into the break, you were in Miami for a meeting of the U.S. Conference of Mayors. I've met some of their professional staff, I've met some of the other mayors, and have been frankly impressed at the level of sort of substantive detail with which they are trying to attack urban problems that New York has in some cases, already mastered, in other cases, we're grappling with or we can sort of see them coming around the corner. What was the focus of the Miami meeting?

Mayor: Errol, I'll tell you something. There were several hundred mayors there from around the country – a tremendous focus on the sequence of challenges we're about to experience in Washington. Real focus on stopping this health care bill, stopping this vote in the Senate – including from a number of Republican mayors, who said openly this is going to be very bad for my city and the people I represent, who are picking up the phone and are calling – Republican to Republican calling some of those swing U.S. Senators. And Democratic mayors who have tremendous ability to organize you know the members of their communities – the civic leaders, the business leaders, the faith leaders – to go right at those same swing senators.

So a real focus on that, but right after that, whatever happens with the health care bill, we have the budget vote happening in September – billions and billions of dollars of the impact on the line for our cities. Same kind of thing, we think there's real strong coalitions to be built. We think a lot of Republican mayors are going to be front and center in that.

Right after that is potentially tax reform – things like ending deductibility of state and local taxes and property taxes, which would have a horrible impact on cities. So there was an incredibly purposeful atmosphere and very substantive people. I've been so impressed by my fellow mayors. There substantive people overwhelmingly who are saying – okay, point by point by point, we need a battle plan to go at this, we need to stop these things from happening to our cities. And I found it very encouraging.

Louis: Okay, we've got more to talk about. Please stand by. We'll be right back with more from Mayor de Blasio in just a minute. Later on tonight, I'll talk about the fight over mayoral control with four top strategists in our Consultants Corner. Stay with us.

[…]

Louis: We are back on The Road to City Hall, and I'm joined once again by Mayor Bill de Blasio. I have a quick health care question for you. Aside from the fact that your politics lead you in the direction of wanting to help the poor and take care of the poor, to the extent that the proposed bill that's working its way through the Senate would do some cost shifting, would push people off of federal Medicaid and shift it to the states, meaning it would become more of a local responsibility. How would that impact New York?

Mayor: Alright a couple things, first although I appreciate your characterization, I want to emphasize I think the Republican bill is going to hurt people across – not just the poor, working people, middle-class people. I think it's going to destabilize the healthcare system and a lot of the guarantees that people need. And it's ultimately about a very, very big tax cut for the wealthy and for major health insurance companies. So, we got to understand a lot of this – a lot of this energy is to get that tax cut down for what they want to do overall in terms of the economy.

But to your question, there's well over a million, maybe as many as 1.6 million New Yorkers who could lose their insurance if the guarantees under Obamacare are no longer available. That obviously has huge ramifications for our public health system too which will inevitably lose a lot of funding in the bargain.

So you're talking about 1.6 million people out of 8.5. It's a huge chunk of the city, and then you're talking about all the other questions about what will be guaranteed in health care going forward. We've gotten under Obamacare rightfully an understanding that health insurance needs to cover a clear basic set of necessary health care options. That's going to go away. You've got, I think in the end, the beginning of the end of any sense of guaranteeing health care as a right to people.

And so, what I'm finding which is interesting is not only as I said have a lot of my Republican colleagues who are mayors started to rebel against think because I think it'll undermined our hospitals, including their private hospitals. I just think it will destabilize their healthcare systems and then ultimately their economies. But now this interesting reality amongst some of the Republicans swing Senators in the U.S. Senate, some concern from the right, others concerned because their seeing a growing impact on their states.

The opioid crisis is one of the prime examples, a lot of states – remember the – if you don't have Medicaid available widely that means you cannot get drug treatment to a lot of people who need it. In places like West Virginia, which is so famously tragically going through the core of this, and I spoke to the mayor of Huntington, West Virginia over the – on Saturday about the opioid crisis in his city, Steve Williams, and it's astounding what they're going through and all over that state.

But one of the only things that's going to help them is if people can get on Medicaid and get regular treatment. You take that away from a place that's already so burdened, it only gets a lot worse. So I think we have to see this as sort of unraveling a lot of the pieces of what we're doing right now to provide any kind of coherent healthcare to people including on mental health, including on substance abuse.

Louis: Let me switch topics now. You went to Rikers Island today. Wednesday is Commissioner Ponte's last day. You've said you would have a replacement by now. Where does the search for a new commissioner stand?

Mayor: As you know there's an acting commissioner in place who's one of Commissioner Ponte's deputies. There have been a number of candidates looked at. Interviews have been held initially – not with me yet. You know, I think we're still several weeks away from finding the right person, but we have got a strong acting commissioner in place. Commissioner Ponte will leave this week, but the work will continue unabated.

Louis: The acting commissioner, Cynthia Brann, wasn't she one of the people who was cited in the report as using her government car to go on shopping trips and all of that sort of thing?

Mayor: Look, I think we have to be very clear. Yes. The answer is yes, but I also want to be very clear. I've said it about Commissioner Ponte, and I believe it about her as well. The rules were not clear in that agency. They should've been. We won't tolerate that going forward. Every agency is being directed to have clear, uniform rules, citywide standard. There are times for a very select few people, with the proper approvals, where they can take their cars home, if for example they have certain emergency responsibilities, but not some of the things we saw in the Department of Correction. It shouldn't have happened, but I don't believe there was any mal-intent. I believe it was a history that was never addressed properly in this administration or the previous.

So we're going to fix that problem, but right now in terms of someone who's ready to continue the leadership, which has helped to reduce violence, has helped to bring about needed reforms at Rikers and the correction system, she's someone who can continue that, doing that over the next few weeks while we find a new commissioner.

Louis: The president of COBA, of the Correction Officers Benevolent Association, apparently was on Rikers Island, but didn't – and was invited by the administration – but chose not to. Do you have a relationship with Mr. Husamudeen?

Mayor: Yes. Sure, Elias is someone I've known for many years, and we talk with some consistency, and I respect his opinion. We sometimes, obviously, disagree on issues like punitive segregation. I understand his view. My view is that we have to end solitary confinement, and it actually is counterproductive to all we're trying to do to rehabilitate people.

But he's raised important concerns, and it was certainly good to talk to some of the rank-and-file today, and I spent some real time there listening to both what some of them thought was working but also some of the challenges that have to be addressed.

So, yes, he was welcome at the event. It doesn't surprise me if a union leader thinks they wants to steer clear of something like that, but there is definitely a dialogue with him.

Louis: Is there a scenario in which the ultimate closure of Rikers – the downsizing, the redistribution of many of the people who are there, the changes in speedy trial and so forth – could happen in less than the 10 years you've projected?

Mayor: Errol, I do not see it, and I will always say we'd love to be surprised pleasantly that changes are happening quicker, but you know part of why I went to Rikers today was to speak to the officers and knowing that the word would spread to all the rank and file that we really believe it will be a 10-year process, and that the folks who are now a part of our workforce are going to be here for the long haul.

We've actually had to add a lot of correction officers just to get up to our full-strength complement we should have. That's still going on now. By the end of the year we'll finally be there, so that we can achieve greater safety in Rikers; we can make the reforms which do require having enough officers. But when you think about – you have keep driving down the crime rate; you have to institute things like bail reform; we need a lot of cooperation from the DAs; we need a lot of cooperation from the state in terms of the court system. All of those things have to happen, and we need sites for additional local jails, and they have to be built. All of that will take real time, so if I saw an opening to do something faster, of course I would take it, but I think it's good to level with people and say by every estimate we think it's 10 years.

Louis: And then finally, the New York Wheel – the gigantic, you're not supposed to call it a Ferris wheel, but it's a gigantic thing that's supposed to be built on Staten Island. There are litigation issues. There seem to be some engineering issues. Is it worth it? How important is it? What's the City going to do about this?

Mayor: The litigation is between private sector parties to the deal and obviously we're concerned about that because the delays are not helpful to anyone. And you know there's been a lot anticipation on Staten Island in terms of the business it would bring, the jobs it would create. So these delays are not helpful.

We're going to be very, very careful on the engineering piece. Our Department of Buildings has done many thousands of inspections of different pieces of the equipment.

There's still some more work to do to really ensure the safety but there's a lot of attention being given to that. But look I'd rather see this all resolved and moving forward but on the safety level we won't allow it to move forward unless we're 100 percent convinced it's ready to go.

Louis: Okay. We're going to leave it there for now.

Mayor: Thank you.

Louis: Thank you so much for coming by. We'll see you again next week.

Mayor: Alright.

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